Episode 54: Growing Together During Life Transitions
A Conversation with Dr. Taylor Dyson, PhD, LMFT
In this episode of The Millennial Life Podcast, Dr. Taylor Dyson of Millennial Life Counseling shares valuable insights on how couples can navigate life transitions together. Whether it’s a career change, moving to a new city, or starting a family, Taylor offers practical strategies for growing as a team during challenging times. Tune in for advice on strengthening communication, fostering emotional support, and deepening your connection to come out of life changes closer than ever.
EPISODE NOTES:
The amount of empowerment that enters the room when couples grow comfort, and safety, and utilize the therapy skills they’re taught is amazing.
Many couples struggle with having the perspective that we all should simply know how to navigate new transitions.
This perspective can lead to feeling immediately defeated when we are not aligning with our partner.
When we notice we are struggling, we need to slow down enough to figure out a game plan.
Big life transitions are seemingly good, positive things, but can stir two different reactions in two different people.
Perspective amidst life transitions can be very powerful.
Trying to make something from before fit into the now will not succeed.
People tend to operate in extremes when they are not at their best.
Moving from a blaming perspective to one of taking ownership can make all the difference as a couple goes through life transitions.
Read more about Taylor here!
Liz Higgins: (00:03)
Hey y'all! Liz Higgins here, and welcome to The Millennial Life Podcast, where my goal is to share conversations that will inspire you and drive you toward the life and relationships you desire. As your host, I'm here to share what I've learned as a licensed therapist, and bring you the transformative voices of other professionals and experts that want you to cultivate relational wellness for life. Thanks for listening, and enjoy the episode!
Taylor Dyson: (00:32)
Hey, Liz!
Liz Higgins: (00:33)
. Hi, Taylor! Thank you for joining me on the podcast today. For those that are listening, Dr. Taylor Dyson is one of our incredible couples therapists at Millennial Life Counseling. And Taylor, how long have you been doing therapy for, um, you know - in total - but like with couples too?
Taylor Dyson: (00:52)
Well, in total, I think it's been about a, a decade. I joke now, I, I feel a sense of empowerment saying like ‘a decade’, because when I first started it was like, ‘oh, I'm a newbie’. Um, but I feel like I am, you know… really grounded in the therapy field. It, it has, it's just a way of life. Something that I thoroughly enjoy. Working with couples has been a little bit of a rollercoaster in terms of the amount of couples that I've worked with. At a time it was a mixture of couples and families, but within the last three years, couples has just elevated to a space where that's majority of my clientele.
Liz Higgins: (01:37)
And how do you like that? You know, how do you feel about that?
Taylor Dyson: (01:40)
Um, you know, a lot of people are intimidated by couples. But I…
Liz Higgins: (01:44)
A lot. A lot.
Taylor Dyson: (01:44)
I want more than one person in the room. There is a level of accountability, a level of vulnerability that opens up when you have a person close to you that, that, that sees you, that knows you. And it, it just opens opportunity for honesty in, in the therapy room. And an opportunity for you to grow together. So, when I'm working with the individual, sometimes I'm navigating the other partner who's not in the room with us and suggesting, you know, how they can work on things, how they can elevate and grow in a healthy way. But when I have the couple in the session and we're working through the nitty gritty, the hard stuff, the vulnerable stuff, the stuff that we try to avoid, we can't avoid in that space. And it, it is amazing to see couples grow - from their first session to their last session - and the amount of empowerment that enters the room when we grow comfort, and safety, and utilize the therapy skills, and watch them actually come to fruition and work.
Taylor Dyson: (02:49)
And that, that is just so beautiful to see. Couples get excited about it. They're, they begin… they start with a sense of nervousness. Like, ‘I don't know how we're gonna do this because we're already stuck in the patterns that we have developed. So it feels foreign to think that we can be different.’ And having, yeah, that third party, in terms of the therapist, there as your resource, as your guide, as your trusted partner in this, it feels like we're not, we're not alone. So we can utilize this space and bring all of our hardships, the areas that we need to grow from, you know, and we, we can bring it and say, ‘here, Taylor, here it is. Here's our mess. Help us clean it up. Help us work through it. We want you to have it.’ And I'm like, ‘give it to me!’
Liz Higgins: (03:34)
Yeah. You know what to do with that. I think that speaks to your experience. And just being able to kind of walk alongside you as you've been here and, and really hear how you work with couples. It's like kind of going back to that thing of 10 years, that's some time under your belt. That's awesome. And like you said, people scare away from couples work sometimes, but I know you have been, like, really devoted to your training and being in that special… specialty area. It feels really important to highlight that because of the topic we have today that you wanted to explore. Which, I think is so relevant: growing together through change. You have to have a therapist that, like, knows what to do with all that stuff that's laid out on the table. Yes. And so I'm excited to hear what you have to say about that!
Liz Higgins: (04:25)
So maybe like, take us down that path a little bit, because, you know, we're a month into the new year. Everybody's like, ‘rah, rah, like, make your relationships better. Let's thrive, not survive’. Right? We use resolutions, all the things. And I think it's starting to probably come down and wear off for people. And we were talking, you know, before we started recording, just about how you are working with so many couples that are coming in with life transitions and just big change happening and the impact that has on their relationship. So tell us a little bit about like, some of those big changes and transitions you see with couples that come to you.
Taylor Dyson: (05:06)
Yeah. So, you know, I definitely think it's important to just kind of hone in on what growing through change looks like. Even for couples to have, you know, preventative measures if, if they notice or they're planning for these things to happen. Or sometimes these things happen unplanned, and we just don't, we just, we've never experienced that before. So we, we might have a, um, strength area prior to these transitions, but then the transitions come and we expect to have that same level of strength at the onset of the transitions. And sometimes it doesn't navigate that way. And you might see couples grow apart, or have this individualized perspective when it comes to transition. So when, um, different couples that I've seen… When, when we discuss transitions, they, it can be defined as having, having a baby. It can even be defined as adding a new baby because we might have grown comfort in the three of us, and now we're adding another element to our system, and we need to grow through that transition.
Taylor Dyson: (06:14)
There could be a move, a big move. If we are leaving home, leaving our village, and there's, uh, one of our partners got the job of their life and we are sacrificing and moving to a, a new space, and we don't know what that looks like. That could be growing through change. Um, another change could be getting married, you know? Getting engaged! That, that is a, that's growing through a, a, a change. You're adding a new element to your life and you're entering something that you've never done before. But couples really have… sometimes struggle with having the perspective that we should just know how to navigate these changes. And we go in with this level of confidence and immediately feel defeated when we're not aligning. When, when we're losing our aspect of communication, when adversity is heavy and it's following us like a dark cloud, and we begin to feel like… We feel lonely, we feel lonely.
Taylor Dyson: (07:11)
We don't lean in with our partner. With some of those unexpected, those unrealistic expectations that they should just know, or I should just know. Um, yeah. Even the grief that can come, come with that of just the newness. And, and so, a lot of couples come in asking for help, like, ‘help us through this transition because we've lost our way. And, um, and that feels sad. And I feel, I feel anxious about the, the future of our relationship, the future of our marriage, if we do not get a hold of this. Because I don't wanna continue down the path that we're going’. So a lot of couples come in looking to understand each other, understand themselves. To slow down, to slow down, um, through this change as well. Because a lot of these things can happen slowly. They can happen suddenly. And we are just really surviving through it, and not slowing down enough to figure out how we feel about it. We can recognize that we're struggling, but we're not slowing down enough to figure out what the game plan is. What is the blueprint, what are the foundational elements that we need to make this transition a successful one that we can grow through together? And successfully.
Liz Higgins: (08:27)
Well, Taylor, I also think about the fact that like, people change too. And imagine going through big life transitions, like having a child, or choosing to get married, and stuff like that. These, like, seemingly good and positive things, but also on the inside… or maybe due to like active personal development… Like, you have two people, two worlds that are literally changing and growing. And so I'm just thinking about that as people navigate whatever, you know, life throws at them. And you shared a lot of like, really relevant, um, examples of like, life transitions. And what I think is fascinating (and I'd love to hear more about from you) is a few of those things, like we were saying, are really good things! Having a child, growing your family, moving for a dream job. Getting engaged. So how is it that, like, some seemingly positive, big life changes can pull a couple apart? Like, what do you think is maybe happening - or not happening - in those relationships that would lead that to happen, versus a couple just really be able to rock through that?
Taylor Dyson: (09:44)
Yeah. That… You make a really good point. You make a really good point in that some of these things we dreamed about, we, we planned as a couple, we fantasized about… it's what we want for ourselves, or it's what we want for our partner, and we get so excited about the planning of these things. Or for the opportunity for these things to happen to us. And then when the thing happens, it's like, ‘why am I not happy about this? Why am I struggling through this? Why are we not connected through this thing that we wanted so badly for ourselves?’ Yeah. And, um, and that can feel defeating too. You can give yourself a hard time because the fantasy that we paint sometimes is not the reality in which we live. And, and we're trying to make that fantasy become our reality. And we also begin to sometimes criticize and judge our partners if they are not navigating this transition in the ways that we wanted them to as well.
Liz Higgins: (10:48)
Oh, I just felt like a, a flush in my… are my cheeks red? Because that has been me!
Taylor Dyson: (10:55)
Listen…
Liz Higgins: (10:56)
The workup therapist, right? So happens to the, the most wise of us…
Taylor Dyson: (11:04)
Yes. Yes. It, it, it, it really can, you know? Having a baby, moving into a new house, it's like, ‘oh!’ When we're talking about it, it's like, ‘oh, let's look at the furniture, and let's map out the baby names.’ And those, those are the, like, the, the fun part because it hasn't happened yet. And it is completely okay to have that fantasy. I don't want, I don't want to suggest that we can't be happy about the things that are planned or unplanned. We can be excited. We can definitely be present in the moment and be happy with that. But we are entering a zone that we've never entered before. And that is the part where I would want couples to slow down and realize they need a game plan for transitions. I've, I've never been a wife before, you know? I, and so why would the, why would I, why would the expectation be that I know how to be this? I know how to be a wife. Yeah. And I, I'm gonna be successful at it, and I'm not gonna fail. I'm just gonna get in there and I'm gonna thrive, and it's gonna be amazing. And my husband too. Oh, I've been with him for 10 years and he's, he already knows what to do, and he knows how to be the husband I want, I need him to be. And when he doesn't show up as such, now I'm like, ‘what happened? No. This is like danger zone.’ Yeah.
Liz Higgins: (12:18)
And it means something bad. It, it, like, means something bad.
Taylor Dyson: (12:21)
Yes. Yeah.
Liz Higgins: (12:22)
Why do we, where did that, I don't know… This is probably a history lesson in some way, but it's fascinating how we kind of do that to ourselves. Like, not moving into something perfect means, like, it means something bad. It means we're not okay. When actually it's really normal.
Taylor Dyson: (12:45)
Yes. Yes, it is. It is. It’s perspective. Perspective can be very powerful in these dynamics and, and what we choose to perceive, and how we choose to navigate those perceptions. I can perceive that this is horrible, that we made the wrong choice. Um, this, you know, why did, why did I listen to you? Or, um, I told you so. Or any of those things. They can really, um, manifest. They can manifest. And they can destroy the opportunity for optimism. For our ability to be successful through this. So when couples come in and they begin to give me some of these nitty gritty things that they've been navigating so far, um, it's the con- what, when I, when, from this perspective, from the therapist seat, I can see that I wanna say to them, this… This is one thing I, you know, I wanna say (and have said)… that the, that the very thing that we wanted we are now struggling through, and we are struggling to find how we're going to benefit in this season of life and how we're gonna come together and shift our perspective and hone in on: what is it that my partner needs?
Taylor Dyson: (14:15)
What is it that I need? How can we navigate through this together and support one another? Um, validate one another, validate the hard. It's okay. It's okay. ‘It's okay to say I don't love this season of life.’ We really wanted, we really wanted a baby. You know, two things can exist. We really wanted this baby. We're so happy that we had this baby, but this is very hard. I didn't know what it would, what it would look like to have to wake up in the night and navigate an eight hour workday. Or the separation anxiety that I have when I have, when I take the baby to daycare. Um, or the, the, um, the, the, the load, the new load. And how do our roles shift now? What, what am I responsible for? What can my partner be responsible for?
Taylor Dyson: (15:07)
Or what can we be responsible for? So we're operating like a team during this transition. Some, some couples expect the mind reading aspect. They expect the assumptions to just flow in. And you should just know, you should just see that I'm tired. You should just step in and say, and do. I shouldn't have to tell you. Couples will say all day long, ‘I shouldn't have to tell him.’ Why not? I hear it so much. Why not? Why not? So along with teaching your partner how to support you in a season that he's never been in, that you've never been in. Why don't we ask him what support looks like when he asks for support? He's asking for permission to love you in the way that you need to be loved.
Taylor Dyson: (16:01)
Instead of seeing the question and realizing that my partner needs me, he or she needs me to guide them through this process. And because they don't know the, the “mommy me”, they know the “wife me”. And they may have excelled in that role before we entered a new transition, before we entered a new home, before I got this job. I don't know this person, and I need to get to know this person. I need to understand what their needs are and how I can show up for them. But I also need to understand what my needs are and communicate that, that as well. Right? Sometimes, sometimes couples, um, struggle with the sharing of feelings and emotions and, because they don't want to seem that their feelings and emotions are less than mine. Or that I'm being selfish in this moment by also sharing what I'm navigating.
Taylor Dyson: (16:58)
But this is vital information that your, that your partner needs to know. But it's also in the way that we share it, Liz, you know? We don't want to seem like we are cross comparing or doing what I call the “Pain Olympics”. Like, who's more tired? Who's more… Who's who worked more, who's load is heavier? Right? We have a heavy load. We are tired. We are navigating this together. And when we enter, when we, when we invite those perspectives in, it becomes a non-productive environment for us to really follow through and put action behind the blueprint. Because there's a sense of resentment, a sense of anger or frustration that I'm not heard. And I don't have a partner on the other side of this conversation that is willing to stand in the storm with me or stand in this transition with me.
Taylor Dyson: (17:49)
And I love to put labels on things, Liz! In terms of calling things… For example, this, these transitions, like, a season of life. Because let's just, let's just focus in on what we're navigating right now. It's not going to be our forever. We won't be in this baby stage forever. We won't be in this new home and it won't feel new forever. We will overcome this stage, and this transition, and, and we will find our comfort levels. But in this season, we really need to work together and figure out what, what, what is our flow? What are, what do we do? How do we navigate this, this, this new transition? This new job that you have and new hours. And, and how are we gonna connect? Okay, what does connection look like now? What does date night look like now?
Taylor Dyson: (18:38)
Let's, let's shift and, and, and leave the before in the before. If it does not fit into the season that we have now, trying to make something before fit into the now might not be successful, um, in the reality in which we live. But we can still, we, like, we wanna do date night, right? Date nights are important, but our date night might look like it's in the house. We might not be going out in this moment. We might be very intentional on putting the baby down and creating date night at home where we still have an opportunity to connect. We're still being intentional. We are still navigating this other role that we had before of husband and wife, because it's still important to bring those roles over and figure out how it fits into this season. But the three date nights a month and trying to fit that into having a new baby or moving into a new home doesn't always fit.
Liz Higgins: (19:37)
Yeah.
Taylor Dyson: (19:38)
Can we get back to three date nights a month? Sure. But not in this season of life, because in this season of life, we still need to connect. But that might look different - on the amount of date nights we have and the type of date nights we have. And we need to be able to flow with the transitions and not be resistant to the very things that we wanted for our marriage.
Liz Higgins: (20:00)
Gosh! That's so true, Taylor. Like you're, you're saying so many critical, and meaningful, and helpful things. I think this piece here of like, the seasonality of change is so important to just marinate on a little bit, you know? 'Cause I, I sort of feel like people operate in extremes. Maybe when we're not at our best, and when we're really stressed and have a lot going on, and our body is just really activated all the time, we can be really extreme about things. And I'm just thinking about myself sometimes in some of those moments. Like, never did I probably sit and kind of meditate on, ‘this is just a phase, it's gonna be okay. It's gonna be different - maybe even in a week, or a month, or a year.’ So that part, step one feels so important. But like, I don't know, it just seems like, um, it's hard to even be aware that you maybe need to pause and do that. Do you find that that's one of the things you're really honing in on with couples when they come in? Really, I guess like, frazzled, activated, disjointed, disconnected?
Taylor Dyson: (21:09)
Yeah. Yeah. You know, I, I love to affirm. I love to reframe. I love to bring in the, the, the difference in perspective for couples. Because sometimes the, the, the perspective that I present is something that they've never thought of. Because they’ve, they've been surviving for this amount of time. They've been so disconnected and caught up in their own story.
Liz Higgins: (21:31)
Yes. Like, we're in our own movie in ourselves. So, you're bringing this different narration to their experience.
Taylor Dyson: (21:41)
You know, I, you know, I make the suggestion that, you know, the two of you, the two of you are sacrificing to the transition that the two of you wanted. The two of you launched this together as, as a unit. And it's important that you navigate this in a constructive way, that it feels like a joint commitment that you are making. And you need to move like a unit. The couples, the couples that come in, Liz, in distress, have a deep desire to change. There is resistance there, and as the therapist, it is important for me to break down the resistance. It's important for me to understand where the resistance comes from. Where it stems from. And, and from there, I'm looking, I'm looking to have… I'm looking for an opportunity for couples to open the door for vulnerability. To share what they're navigating, to share the struggles.
Taylor Dyson: (22:45)
And, and I, I re-invite the fantasy, right? I re-invite the fantasy, but from a different perspective. Because when you are caught up in your own stuff, most of the time, the fantasy in that moment is that we just reconnect. Forget the fantasy that we, that we had prior to the move, to the baby, the, the, the engagement. I just miss my partner. You know, I miss my partner. I miss our connection. And this feels defeating because I felt empowered when we were, when we were navigating a relationship where we just got each other and we did that. And it, it was…
Liz Higgins: (23:24)
Seamless. It was so easy. It was so easy.
Taylor Dyson: (23:27)
Yes. And, and I'm asking for help, but I'm, but I, but that help has been coming out in anger, in passive aggressive behavior. It's been coming out through criticism instead of understanding what it is I need. And simply saying to my partner, I need you. I need you. I'm struggling. And I don't know how to do this. And I, and because I'll say, have you ever been a husband before? Have you ever been a wife before? Have you ever moved across the country before? Have you ever worked these hours before? You know, Liz, 90% of the time I hear, no, no.
Liz Higgins: (24:11)
And that's like breaking the walls down. You know, that, that's protecting that piece of, ‘I'm supposed to know how to do all this. You are supposed to know how to do all this.’ Yes. I imagine you must see people kind of melt back into their seat a little bit when, when you're kind of, uh, you know, putting that out there for them. Because I don't think we move through life really thinking about that piece right there.
Taylor Dyson: (24:37)
Yeah. You know, I'm, I'm definitely looking to change the language. Shift their perspectives and put, insert, you know, different action items, different ways for couples to be intentional. Practicing that in session, you know, looking at someone in their eyes, Liz, is something so powerful. I'm vulnerable. I, I want to, I want them to pretend that I'm not even there. You know, I want them to use some of that groundwork and that framework that created success before, um, and bring those aspects into this new season of life and minimize the warped perspective, the warped fantasies. Let's talk about what we're navigating now. You've been in it, ] you've been a mom for a little bit before you came here. So, we know what we're navigating, what the adversity is, what we're, what our struggles are. And I encourage you to look at your partner and say, I need you, uh, at night, during the day, when I, after I drop the baby off to daycare, I need a safe space to land.
Taylor Dyson: (25:46)
I really wanna be heard by you. I really wanna be seen by you. I want to hear you. I also want to see you. I wanna know what this is like for you. Because it's not, it's… There's no one way to be. There's no, there's, there's, we don't, we don't have a blueprint or a one size fits all. So when they come to me, I want to create a unique blueprint for this person and that person in their unit. I can't even bring in a blueprint that I used in the prior session to this session, Liz, because I'm working with two different people. So I need to understand who they are. I need them to understand who they are so that they can give me this information. And collaboratively we can create a blueprint that's unique to their marriage, their relationship, their move, their new family.
Taylor Dyson: (26:35)
And they feel very comfortable in that. Very comfortable and confident in how they show up, and the language in which they use. The gratitude in which they express how to affirm your partner in this, in this moment. How to sit with the heart and not allow it to, um, you know, drown, drown the vibes of the day. Like, you know, in terms of owning, like, yes, this is really hard. Like, I struggled today. Right? And, and I want, I want to bring awareness to that. But I don't want this to be the, the mood of the week, you know? But I do wanna say, today was hard. I don't wanna be able to say that, um, and, and, and not feel like, ‘oh, my husband's gonna think that I'm not a good mom, or I'm not a good wife because I said that this is hard. Or, or I regret this. Or I don't want this. I, I want to be able to define what I mean when this is hard.’ So, we'll, you know, we'll have those conversations in session and you will notice, you will see a sense of relief when vulnerability enters the room. It's not something they've seen before or heard before. And sometimes they say, “you never said that to me before!”
Liz Higgins: (27:40)
Yeah. Yeah.
Taylor Dyson: (27:41)
“Why don't, why did I not know this? Why did I not, I didn't know you were struggling. I thought… you make it seem like you have it all together. Or even how you approach me, it makes me feel like I have to meet you where you are. And I, I need to just know. I don't feel comfortable sharing that I'm struggling. Because you seem to have really, like, grasped the concept of being a parent. And I didn't know if it was safe enough to say that, I don't know, I'm struggling. I don't know how to do this.” You know?
Liz Higgins: (28:09)
That's a big one! 'Cause I think, you know, you and I both know having, um, learned through a systemic model, right? A lot of times in relationships there is kind of this, you know, “opposites attract” almost dynamic with like our relational moves. And there can be like that over-functioner or that person that's really emoting and expressing and like, struggling! And the other one that just seems pretty chill. Or like, they're good and they've got it together. And so, what you were describing right there, I think is so huge. 'Cause it can really lead people to feel like isolated in their pain or their struggle, definitely not seen by their partner. And so, you're describing these moments in therapy really, where you can help get people to that place where they finally say the thing like, this has been so hard for me. Or, you know, I, I I wanna be there for you. Like, words that probably aren't being said or exchanged a whole lot during more of these like, you know, rocky phases of transition and stuff.
Taylor Dyson: (29:16)
Yes. Here lately, I've been seeing and just kind of, it, it, there's been a, for me rather, I've seen a lot of content on couples surviving versus couples like thriving. And surviving was defined by this kind of like this, almost like a roommate or, um, like a roommate perspective, or we're just like coexisting in, in this season, in these transitions or these seasons. And like the, the example… One example that I saw would, you know, be a, a mother who is, um, you know, feeding, trying to fold laundry and, and feeding the baby, right? And the partner just like, walks, walks by and just sees it happening, but goes and gets the water and goes back up to the room. And, you know, watching TV or doing something of that nature versus a partner who, again, we are, we're going to suggest that they're in therapy with me and we're talking about how to be collaborative.
Taylor Dyson: (30:26)
But he might walk by, he or she might walk by and see their partner multitasking and step in. And step into that space and sit next to their partner and begin folding together, uh, folding the clothes together. And that would be defined as thriving through these transitions. Because this is our, our navigation, our transition. And you're not alone. Yeah. Your mere presence, um, shows me that I'm not alone. The action of grabbing a bib and folding it, or a towel I’m folding, it shows that you want to be in this with me. Um, and if I've stated that that is a way that I feel supported, then I can validate that feeling. I can affirm those, that safety that, that you provided in this moment for something that would be so simple that I didn't even know could be so impactful in, in this space. Sitting, you know, sitting next to you folding baby clothes. Like, look at us, you know? Look at us. We're doing this.
Liz Higgins: (31:28)
Yeah. Well, and your point is so huge. It's not about the folding, it's not about the clothes. It's about the act of joining in, of showing up and being there. And that even though it's like, you know, this mundane, routine task, it's a moment where you can actually experience intimacy.
Taylor Dyson: (31:51)
Right. It, you know, I, I share sometimes that in different transitions, in different seasons of my life, I have shifted what I find attractive in my partner. Right? You know? Before we became a family, like, sure, there were different things with when we were just husband and wife that I found attractive. But holding the baby was like, oh my gosh. Like, oh, look at you being a dad. Like, oh, that's evoking some feelings, you know? I'm like, wow. Or carrying the diaper bag to, you know, and like, you know, the carrier into the grocery store. Like, oh, you know, it's just, you know, that shift in perspective of like, I am, I'm just, I'm adapting to this transition and I'm shifting my mindset and our lives around this season. Like sure. Like sure. It, it's, it's okay.
Taylor Dyson: (32:51)
It's okay to change. I can, it's even okay to say I'm fearful of what this means for us. But even just acknowledging that, is putting you in the right direction to shifting your perspective versus being resistant to that fear. Like, oh, nope, I don't wanna feel that. No, we'll be fine. We've been fine. We've been fine these five years we've been together, we've created a solid foundation. Nope. There's no fears. Sure. Sure there are. Sure there are. Let's talk about it. And it's okay. It is okay. It's, it is actually empowering to hear you say that you're fearful of these things, because then we can, again, create and put that in the blueprint. So now there's a level of grace that would come with hearing my husband say, “I'm so afraid of being a dad. I don't know what that looks like.
Taylor Dyson: (33:39)
I really, really wanna get, I really wanna get it right.” And because of that, because of, of what my, the fantasy of what I want and the reality of it happening, I just don't know what that looks like and it scares me. Yeah. And to hear your partner say, “I'm right here with you. Um, thank you for sharing that with me.” I would be mindful of critical statements related to him being a dad. You know, we, we wanna continue to be safe with the topics that we share that are vulnerable spaces. So that's an, you know, another, um, opportunity in therapy to come in and understand what it means to be a safe space for your partner. How to accept vulnerability, and work with that, and grow through that. Right? Because we're not looking, we're not looking to stay stuck either with the fears or the vulnerable moments that we share.
Taylor Dyson: (34:27)
We're sharing that so that we can begin putting action on what does growth look like through that vulnerability? How can we grow through this vulnerability that eventually becomes an area of confidence for us? And we feel very confident in that. We can come back and say, I appreciate you giving me the space and opportunity to grow in this area. And I, I, I feel very, I feel great. I feel great. Now I feel like I'm getting the hang of this, um, the environment supported that, that growth for me, and I'm appreciative, and, and they're able to express that gratitude and that affirmation and that reassurance to the space that we created together. Yeah. Um, I let couples know all the time that this is a joint thing. The safety that you create, the vulnerability that you invite, that's a joint effort.
Liz Higgins: (35:15)
Yeah. Both, both people do that. And I think it's, like, so important to acknowledge, like, it's okay if you're not able to just figure that out and, and do that. I think you're speaking to the truths about how helpful therapy really can be. Like really, seriously, can be for people when they're in the midst of big change or transition that's just kind of got them gridlocked and they, they can't seem to get to that place of really being vulnerable with their fears and their feelings and stuff… that somebody like you, you know, you know what to do with that stuff. You know, how to kind of help them intentionally move towards just putting it on the table. Yes. And then actually starting to work with it. And then helping them really lean in towards each other and acknowledge what's going on. And, you know, I just, can you say a little more about like, just therapy, honestly? And how it really can serve this purpose for couples to help them, you know, I guess crossover that bridge, that hump, whatever you wanna call it?
Taylor Dyson: (36:21)
Yeah. You know, sometimes there's a perception that, you know, in this space, individuals, couples, whomever, you know? They’re coming in and just airing their grievances, they're just coming in. Yeah. And I'm just airing grievances, and I don't wanna do this back and forth. That's definitely something with couples and why some couples might, um, resist coming into therapy. Because I don't want this to get worse. Like, I'm gonna come in and already know how we operate right now. So, I'm gonna go in and share my grievances. You're gonna share our grievances. And we're gonna do this back and forth for an hour. I'm not wasting my time doing everything. Right? We can do that at home.
Liz Higgins: (36:57)
How is this gonna be any different kind of thing? Right.
Taylor Dyson: (37:00)
You know? And that's not what that looks like in this space. That's not, that's not the way in which I navigate a therapy session. Sure. Do I wanna know what the presenting problems are? Do I wanna know what brings you to therapy? Sure. But as your therapist, um, of course I ask for permission to interrupt , but I will interrupt and stop the process. I'm, I'm looking to see what the cycle is, but I'm looking to stop the cycle from that. I'm looking to hone in on what you're saying. I usually take all the, the, the mess, if you will, the nitty gritty details. And I'm looking for key points. I'm looking to hear the verbiage that he doesn't do anything. She doesn't do anything. She's not helping me. I've been navigating this by myself, and, and I'm stressed and I'm tired. And understanding what that, what that, what, what that person is really saying.
Taylor Dyson: (37:52)
Okay, let me slow you down. Let me slow you down right there. Let's talk about that for a minute. Let's talk about, let's look for exceptions to the problem. Let's… Tell me about a time when your husband was there for you and what that feel, what that feeling was like. And why there was so much passion in what you're saying right now. Because you've experienced the teamwork aspect, you've experienced the partnership, you've experienced the safety of knowing that I have someone that has my back, and I'm not, I don't have that right now. I don't, I don't, I don't feel that right now. And I'm missing that feeling. So, and then they're, they're, you know, they're, they begin to calm down a bit, Liz, because I'm creating a calmer, softer environment where we… You don't have to be amplified in this environment. I don't, I want, I want your nervous system to be at ease.
Taylor Dyson: (38:41)
I want you to know that you can talk and say all the things you need to say without being emotionally reactive to the point where you are spewing out information, and minimizing vulnerability, and talking to your partner, talking to them instead of talking at them. And we are now looking for the opportunity to be impactful. So I'm gathering information so that we can understand how we're going to move forward. I always tell couples I'm not looking to stay stuck. I know you all want me to know every single detail of the past and what, what brought you here and why this perspective is so strong for you. And I, I wanna understand that. I wanna understand how you got here, but I also want, I also wanna move you forward. And any step, Liz, a baby step is a step. I'm all for moving forward. I don't care how fast we go, but I, I am looking to unstuck to… to get a couple unstuck. And that's where my mom, my mom would not… that’s not a word. She would not like my improper grammar..
Liz Higgins: (39:43)
But I mean, you know, we all use that term. I think, you know, “getting unstuck”. And it's so weird to like, to know this, but I just know it's true. Like, um, the conflict and the resistance to change… Even though we may verbalize, verbalize, verbalize that we wish things were different. It can actually be comfortable And change can really be challenging because it's not just about “what are you gonna change for me?” But it's also “how do I contribute to this change that I wanna see?” And so, I don't know, I'm just curious, like, how do you see people kind of reconcile that piece of like, you know, the things that you're pointing to this other person needing them to do differently is also kind of this invitation for you to look inward and see what changes you need to make. Do you find people really embrace that? Or… I'm sure there's all different kinds of responses people may have, but what do you think about that?
Taylor Dyson: (40:50)
Yeah, so Liz, I do, I, um… There, there is this kind of, um, dance or cycle that the couple's already in before they come to me. And it is the blaming perspective. It's the, let me tell you what you need to do for me. And then the other person is sharing those same level of grievances and we're, you know, doing the back and forth. And so, early in the session, I like to practice the framework of being self-reflective. And ownership, and finding empowerment and accountability, and just understanding how what we bring, what we bring to what we have, have brought to this circumstance, in this environment that we, that we were in before we came to therapy. The, the ownership that I'm resistant. The ownership that I'm resentful. Like I need, I need you to tell me about you.
Taylor Dyson: (41:46)
I need you to tell me what you are navigating and what you bring to the table. And why you present the way that you do. Don't tell me about your partner in this moment. I, he's, he or she's gonna have the opportunity to tell me about them. But I want you to tell me about you. And you know, when in these, in these sessions, I probably get some eye rolls, Liz, because it is easy. It's so, so easy for me, for even now, for me to point the finger, um, to the outside and not sit with this level of accountability, um, about how I either contribute to the dynamics, the unhealthy dynamics that we have, or how I started it, you know? And I keep that, I keep that fire alive. Yes. I come in with the passive aggressive sarcasm responses. You know, I slam the door, I hang up, I do those, yeah, I do those things because you are harboring and holding onto this hurt and this pain.
Taylor Dyson: (42:39)
And that's what I need to get to. That's what I need to get to. I don't, we, I don't, I'm, I'm not the referee in the, in the, in the session. I am the resource. I'm the helpmate. I'm gonna insert myself into this system and I'm gonna look to… I'm going to ask you all to look to me for guidance. I'm gonna ask you to try this very foreign thing that you've never done before and tell me it doesn't work. I want you to come back. I dare you to come back and tell me that it won't be impactful in this situation. In this scenario, I ask for commitment, Liz, from the both, uh, from both partners, that they wanna do this. And when, when I'm asking for that commitment, I am reframing that and helping them see, it's okay. It's okay. We're creating safety in this moment.
Taylor Dyson: (43:25)
That person sitting next to you says they wanna be here with you. They want to fix this. Just as you want to fix this, they wanna fix this. Do you hear, do you hear your partner there? Did you hear your, did you see your partner shake, shake their head and say, yes, that I want to do this? Do you hear their level of commitment? They don't want… They came in here fighting with you, but they don't wanna fight with you because they just told me that they wanna be committed to this process. And this process is a process that moves us forward to the point where we feel very confident and comfortable in this transition. And that we, we feel empowered about how we do our thing. I'm willing to teach my person how to love me, how to support me, how to be there for me, and give them an opportunity to show up. Yeah. Give your partner an opportunity to learn this new thing. This new thing, but they need you. They need your help. So, are you gonna help them today? Are you gonna help them through this process? And they're like, you know, they're like, yes. You know? Don't think that I get this optimistic. Yes. Like, it's not, it is not, I mean, it inspires me.
Liz Higgins: (44:27)
If I were your client, I'd be like, okay… You know? But I just wanna say real quick too, Taylor, like for people listening. What you just did there and what you are describing is your presence and your stance in therapy is a real art. I believe. That's kind of my opinion. And it takes a long time. I think, you know, 10 years for you, right? You're 10 years in, but to like, kind of lead with that confidence as a therapist... And I think when it comes to relationships in crisis, in the midst of big change, you don't have a lot of time. You don't have a ton of money to waste. Like, you need to know you're gonna get help from somebody that actually knows how to help you evoke relational change. And just hearing everything you said, you know, it's just a reminder for me of how powerful (I'm sure) some of those sessions can be for people. Because you put those things out there and so many therapists are kind of taught to be a real blank slate and to kind of take the lead of the client and just go where they go.
Liz Higgins: (45:32)
But I think you have to have some of the structure that you're describing there - just to keep on track exactly your own blueprint. And I love that you do, and I love that it's not like a blueprint that came from, just like, one way of thinking or operating or working with couples. 'Cause I know about you, like you really expand yourself into different kinds of trainings and stuff to help with all this. And I think that's valuable for couples. Yeah.
Taylor Dyson: (46:04)
Yes. Mm-hmm. You know, I… I've always had the philosophy that, you know, the, the couple is the expert of their lives. But, you know, I'm, I'm the expert in the room when it comes to navigating the change in the growth that they're looking to see. I never want, I, I never want a couple or anyone to come in and feel like I'm only intentional on Tuesdays at 2:00. Right? 'Cause the amount of work that we are going to do in this session is setting up the intentionality that you're going to exhibit when you leave that room. Um, and I'm an accountability type of therapist, Liz. So we're gonna, I'm going to follow up, we're gonna talk about it. I'm gonna, I'm gonna hold you accountable because you trusted me to move you forward. And I want you to, I want you to move forward. So the very things that I'm asking you to try and implement, I'm gonna follow up with you and hold you accountable out of love.
Liz Higgins: (47:01)
Yeah. That is love, though. Like, like, I don’t know. That is love. Wouldn't you say? And like, even in couple relationships - holding each other accountable, like, that's love.
Taylor Dyson: (47:12)
Yes. Yes. So, you know, Liz, there's not a whole, there's not a lot of topics that scare me. You know? I wanna talk about it all. I value the couple relationship. I, I, I value that space. I feel very blessed, I feel very fortunate to be able to be in the space. So I don't take, take couples lightly when they bring me their mess and say, “here, I'm trusting you with it. Help us.” And I take that on and I'm like, “Let's rise. Let's go.”
Liz Higgins: (47:49)
Yeah. That is so you, and it's impressive. It impresses, you know, everybody on our team, I know. Because most therapists, even couples therapists, are not actively saying, bring me the high conflict . We're kinda like, okay, I know I can do it, I can do it, I can do it. And you're just like, you know, bring it. Let's, let’s go.
Taylor Dyson: (48:09)
Yeah. All of it. All of it. Please don't leave anything out. I wanna know everything. Yeah. But I'm gonna take all of those things and we're gonna create a plan together. And we are gonna begin. Let's, let's start. We are at the starting line looking to get to the finish line. And I, I say in the first session that I cannot wait for you all to tell me, “Taylor, we have, we feel so confident. All of our goals have been met and we don't need you anymore.”
Liz Higgins: (48:38)
Yeah.
Taylor Dyson: (48:39)
Just always music, music to my ears, you know? To, to see…
Liz Higgins: (48:42)
That's awesome.
Taylor Dyson: (48:43)
See the growth.
Liz Higgins: (48:45)
Yeah. That's amazing. Taylor. So like, to kind of wrap this whole thing up… If somebody listening is really trying to suss out, like, do I need therapy? Or they're nervous that their partner wouldn't be, you know, on board with going, with participating. Like, someone that's just kind of really unsure about what to do next, but is dealing with big stuff. What would you say to them?
Taylor Dyson: (49:11)
Well, I'm gonna, I'm gonna take you two, two different routes. Yeah. If we're talking about, you know, um, what we presented today in terms of transitions, you know? I, I want, I would want a couple, I would want a person, a couple, to feel empowered by the lack of knowledge, the lack of security, the lack of confidence that I know how to do something I've never done before. And to look at this as an opportunity to set yourself up for success, and set your partner up for success, and learn how to navigate this in a healthy way. To, to utilize this space as an opportunity to grow. Not because you have to come in and say, we are a mess. Maybe you are a mess. And that is okay because we're on the other side of the transition. But if you, if you can preplan, or you know that you are looking to shift your dynamics in your, in your life as an individual or as a couple, then therapy would be an amazing opportunity for you to learn a lot about yourself, and set yourself up for success, and set your marriage up for success.
Taylor Dyson: (50:30)
And you know what else, Liz? When it comes to therapy in general, I want people to see therapy as an opportunity to pour into yourself.
Liz Higgins: (50:39)
Mm.
Taylor Dyson: (50:40)
Evolution is a way of life. So even though we're talking about transitions through couples, we transition as individuals. If you are a person that is for growth and evolving, which I think most people, most people are… you're going to navigate some level of adversity. And how you navigate that, and how you deal with that, and the feelings that come with that can be very heavy. And I would encourage anyone to utilize a therapy space, to pour into themselves and give back. Give, give back, and learn, and implement. You could even be a model for someone else out there because you learned how to do it right. Because again, Liz, I, I don't, I, I'm still, I'm still learning. I'm still growing. I'm still evolving. There are still things, there are still walks of life that I have yet to enter. And right now, I can tell you I'm gonna have to relearn how to do it at that time.
Taylor Dyson: (51:42)
When, when, when that, when that opportunity comes up, the how I navigate that, the level of coping skills that I utilize when I get older, that might not be the same coping skills that I use at this age. I need help. I need help. I need someone who knows how to do this to teach me how to do this. So, I would say to anyone that is on the fence, consider thinking that therapy is an opportunity to grow. It's an opportunity for you to love yourself, to pour into yourself, to be intentional with your growth and your mental development. And I would encourage anyone to look into it because it can be life-altering. So that's it.
Liz Higgins: (52:27)
Thank you. Oh, I love it. Oh my gosh! I'm like, there's so many good social media posts that are gonna come out of this episode today. 'Cause it's just all such good, relevant stuff, and I think fitting for so many people listening right now. So thank you, Taylor, for shining light on how people can move through change, like you said, in their lives. Individually, but also relationally, which is kind of our zone of genius and our area of specialization. So, we're definitely going to put links to Taylor's bio down in the notes. And is there anything else you would like listeners to know about you and the work that you do? And, you know, again, like for people listening, sometimes we get people all over, but Taylor, you see clients in Dallas and – essentially - in Texas virtually. So yeah. Anything else you would want listeners to know about you?
Taylor Dyson: (53:20)
You know, I, um, well… I tell, I tell everyone that I am Taylor in session. It might say Dr. Taylor on, on the outside of the office. But when I say that I'm Taylor, you know, I'm, I'm bringing my authentic self into the room. I want, I want clients to know that I've either experienced the adversity, or I'm willing to learn about the adversity that they're experiencing. And I, you know, I wanna walk this path with them. The type of clientele that I currently see right now… Yes, our high, high conflict couples come see me. You know, definitely, um, the, um, individuals that are going through transitions, life transitions… Whether that's through a, through a relational aspect or an individual aspect. You know, those… You know what? Let me think what else, Liz… That I see quite often, um, in this space, you know, individuals that are navigating kind of, where, where my life is going.
Taylor Dyson: (54:26)
Kind of like, I wouldn't say “failure to launch” Liz, 'cause that's not what we’re navigating. But there's been a lot of change in society when it comes to relationships, dating, and this kind of fear that I am behind. And navigating that that's even a transition in itself, you know? Yeah. When you think about it, you know, again - those fantasies that we create, and the feelings of disappointment that we might have about how our life is going, and just looking for guidance about what, you know, what my future looks like… And you know, how to mentally navigate that. So, anyone who is in need of a therapist that… And, and some of these things stick out to you, you know, I would love, um, to work with you. To understand what your goals are and, you know, assist you to the finish line.
Liz Higgins: (55:14)
Awesome! And like I said, we'll drop those links so people can go straight to more information about you, Taylor, and your bio, and stuff like that. So, thanks again for joining me. I really am already looking forward to the next conversation we have on here, so thanks for, for coming!
Taylor Dyson: (55:30)
Thank you, Liz! I'll talk to you soon.
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